Andrew Clennell
Well Michaelia Cash, thank you for joining me. I wanted to start by asking you about this claim by government sources to me and also by the ACTU secretary Sally McManus, that there are restrictions in this new industrial relations legislation on striking that the bill does not make it that easy to strike in this multi employer bargaining situation, there has to be conciliation and arbitration first, what do you say that?
Senator Cash
Well, there’s only one thing that Labor’s industrial relations bill will lead to, and that is more strikes and less jobs. And hence, going forward, Minister Burke will only be known as the minister for strikes. Andrew, a very simple proposition: if you did not want to encourage more strike action, why would you open up the industrial relations landscape to more strikes? But not only that, we’ve now had John Setka come out on behalf of unions in Australia saying, “This is fantastic.” And I quote, “We can now go after non unionized sites.” Blind Freddie can tell you that when every employer group in Australia stands up united – and I don’t think that’s ever happened before – stands up united and says the only thing that this bill does is lead to more strikes and less jobs, I know who I believe.
Andrew Clennell
Alright, well do you believe wages should stay at their current levels, or with inflation, they should rise?
Senator Cash
Everybody in Australia wants higher wages, but unleashing an industrial relations system with radical changes that take us back to the 1970s is not the way to do it. More strikes across our economy, dragging employers who have great relationships with their employees to the negotiating table kicking and screaming, is not the way to get higher wages. What this bill does as well, which I have to say, is probably one of the most dangerous changes this country and employers will ever see, and has been spoken of by Mr. Burke as an amendment, is to now give unions the right to veto multi employer agreements in this country. So to give you an example, a workplace with 100 people, the employer works with the employees, they reach agreement, 99 of the employees say, “This is fantastic, our wages are going up.” But the union representing one can now step in and say no. Again, this is without a doubt a piece of legislation that is going to wreak industrial and economic chaos on this country. And when you are in a situation, Andrew, and you’ve just articulated it, higher cost of living, higher electricity prices, higher inflation, higher interest rates, why, unless you were capitulating to the demands of the unions across Australia, would you in any way unleash industrial chaos on this country? And there is only one answer. The Labor Party is paying their union paymaster.
Andrew Clennell
Do you think that you could convince David Pocock, then, to novel some of these particular aspects of the bill you don’t like?
Senator Cash
Well the bad news for David Pocock and the rest of the crossbenchers, but in particular, the bad news for employers and employees across Australia is this: Mr. Burke tables the legislation last week., he says in his second reading speech, “The legislation is a dog’s breakfast, and on that basis, we’re going to have to make amendments.” I mean, that is actually shameful within itself. He then says, “One of those amendments is we need to ensure unions have the right to veto agreements made between employers and employees in this country.” And then the Labor Party move for a three week committee process. So employers this weekend across Australia are scrambling to understand a 250 page piece of legislation, a 261 page explanatory memorandum. They have to have their submissions in by next week. I understand the first hearing is next Friday and the Labor Party have been very upfront, “We will be ramming this legislation through in the final sitting week of parliament.”
Andrew Clennell
They have been upfront, and as I reported they want to, I guess, avoid a campaign against it.
Senator Cash
And isn’t that shameful, Andrew? Exactly. They want to avoid a campaign, a campaign across Australia that shows the truth.
Andrew Clennell
Do you think the Senate will be able to adjust that though? My understanding is it was about to vote that way to have it go until February, but Pauline Hanson was absent last week.
Senator Cash
Well again this is up to the Labor Party. They say they are out there now undertaking discussions with interested parties. The only interested party that has come out at the moment is the union movement. John Setka saying, “Fantastic news.” Not only is the Labor Party handing back control of the construction industry to John Setka and the CFMMEU, but John Setka openly states, “This bill gives the unions the ability to now go after non unionized workforces.”
Andrew Clennell
Don’t you welcome the Government cutting the construction out of the bill, the CFMEU, and changes to the Better Off Overall Test?
Senator Cash
Absolutely laughable. The Government actually getting rid of the CFMEU from the bill. What, for 18 months they behave themselves, and then they’re back in? But in this exact same bill, Andrew, they hand the construction industry on a platter back over to the construction union. Why do you think John Setka is out there welcoming this legislation? Because he knows that the CFMMEU, they are back in town. They are back in town because the Labor Party is getting rid of the tough cop on the beat. Just in relation to the changes to the BOOT, these changes I brought to the Parliament 18 months ago. And guess what? The Labor Party, for political purposes only, fought against those changes every step of the way.
Andrew Clennell
Do you welcome them then? Do you welcome them then? I know, I get your point.
Senator Cash
Andrew, they will mean absolutely nothing when the unions are running this country. As I said, when you have every employer organisation, small business, medium business, large business across Australia, stand up united and say, “For God’s sakes, this bill is only going to decimate our economy.” The hospitality industry have come out, they’ve been very open, and they’ve said we will be closing down businesses. Andrew, higher inflation, higher interest rates, higher electricity prices, one has to ask oneself, why? Why would the Labor Party unleash economic chaos across Australia unless it was doing it for one reason? And that is literally to deliver the industrial relations framework and our economy to the union movement.
Andrew Clennell
There’s just a couple other things I want to ask you about in the limited time we have left. Why did Angus Taylor and Scott Morrison push the determination on the first electricity price hike past the election? That was a bit dishonest, wasn’t it?
Senator Cash
Well, I fundamentally disagree with you. You’d also be aware that a draft determination actually came out in February. I just saw the interview with Chris Bowen. Are you telling me that Chris Bowen, Anthony Albanese and the Australian Labor Party were too lazy to read the draft determination? This is an independent organisation. The Government, now opposition, saw the determination when it was finally released. But in February of this year, a draft determination which set out the landscape, Andrew, was released.
Andrew Clennell
Regulations were put through to push the final determination past the election, do you concede that?
Senator Cash
Again, a draft determination, handed down in February, if they’re too lazy to have read it, we saw the final determination when it came out because this is an independent body. But put that all aside, –
Andrew Clennell
After Angus Taylor pushed it past the election, correct?
Senator Cash
I fundamentally disagree with you, again, in February, all parties across Australia who had bothered to read the draft determination knew what they were dealing with. The Labor Party, Andrew, is now in power and 97 times before the election, what did they say to the Australian people? We will reduce your electricity bill by $275. They can’t even mention the word 275 now.
Andrew Clennell
Just a couple of quick questions. Do you think the Government needs to consider price caps, bill relief, domestic gas reservations, like they have in your home state?
Senator Cash
I think it was really interesting to watch that interview with Chris Bowen, because the one thing that he didn’t address was bringing supply into the market. You cannot talk about price caps if you are not at the same time saying we are going to address the supply of gas coming into the market. And in fact, what you saw in the budget was the exact opposite. The Labor Party have actually cut, I think there were two projects in excess of $50 million, that would have enabled further gas exploration. So whilst the Labor Party are having these thought bubbles in relation to what they may or may not do, the one thing they are failing to address, which internationally it is shown you must address, is bringing further gas into the market, bringing on that supply. All a price cap will do is actually discourage players from bringing on supply. Where is their plan to bring on supply? There is none.
Andrew Clennell
Okay, just briefly and finally, what is your reaction to the movement by the Australian Government of women and children out of Syrian refugee camps, Australians, back to Australia this weekend?
Senator Cash
I personally think that this is not a decision that has been made in the best interests of the Australian people. A fundamental thing that a government must always do is act in the national interest and in the best interests of Australians. These people understood they made a decision and the decision would have consequences. We now need the Prime Minister of Australia to front the Australian people and say, “This is the investigation that was undertaken prior to the Labor Party making the decision.” What security measures are they now putting in place to ensure that at all times Australians are kept safe? These are people who have been living in a situation whereby they have associated with people who hate Australia. They hate our way of life. They have been associating with terrorists, terrorists who have committed atrocious, atrocious, unspeakable, unspeakable acts. You know, as Peter Dutton said, for one person who is a security risk, it takes around 300 police officers and $4 million per year to ensure that we know what they are doing. The Prime Minister needs to front the Australian people because, Andrew, if there is any risk to the Australian people, Mr. Albanese and the relevant minister, they will assume full responsibility for their decisions.
Andrew Clennell
Michaelia Cash, thanks for your time.
Senator Cash
Great to be with you, as always.
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